Interview 1
Name: Hong Nam Hee
Sex: Female
Age: Late 40s
Area: Songcheon County, South Pyongan Province
Job: Trader
– What is your occupation?
I was a manager in a factory. There were a lot of coal mines so many workers lived there. But now that my condition is bad, I’m not able to work. My husband is sick, too. There’s no way to earn a living. I came out to find things to sell, but it’s not working out as well as I had hoped.
– Is the factory currently idle?
In the past when I was working it was okay and production levels were good. But the machinery stopped in the late 1990s. Now, there is no work, and no raw materials to work with.
– So what do the workers do all day?
They go out to work in society. From May, they go out to support agricultural activities; rice planting, and from June they do weeding. And then in autumn they go out for crop harvesting.
– When did factory production really start to go bad?
At the time of the ‘March of Tribulation’ factories ground to a halt. Factories literally stopped one by one. So people took apart the factory and sold the parts because they were hungry. They even took machinery motors and cables. There is no way to recover these things. And there’s no money. They couldn’t give rations when the March started, and they still can’t now.
– You don’t receive any rations at all?
There are times when we get them; during national holidays or on Kim Jong Il’s birthday or Kim Il Sung’s birthday.
– So if you’re not getting rations, how do you live?
That’s what I’m saying; women go out and sell things. If you don’t do anything like that, you won’t even be able to survive on porridge. It’s just about going out to the jangmadang and earning a living in that way, just like that.
– What types of trade have you done?
A bit of this and a bit of that. I’ve sold clothes. I’ve sold clothes brought in from China. It wasn’t a lot, but I did manage to sell a few.
– I’ve also heard that drug dealing is on the rise.
There are people who sell materials for drugs. Mind you, many people use them as medicine. They help sick people with their ailments.
In particular, people with bad backs often medicate themselves with drugs. People with cancer do the same. Smearing the drug on the skin and adding some heat is said to dissolve the cancerous cells. The doctor really did say that. It’s also good for nervous disorders and inflammation, too. I tried it and it worked.
– Aren’t those controlled substances?
We’re not just smoking it; we’re using it for medicinal purposes. It’s unavoidable. Who’s going to control that, anyway? If they control it then the government should help patients in need. The price of it is quite high, so those with money all use it, at least just to try it once before they die.
– Are all your family members eating three meals a day?
It’s still hard no matter what. Because I am selling things we generally eat three meals a day, but people who are not like me have a hard time having three meals. They eat corn. Before, they got rations, but now that they don’t give them out; some people only eat corn, I guess.
– How many people are just getting by on corn noodles or porridge?
Now that the market is not doing so well, noodle sellers are having a hard time. The people who earn a lot can live one month off one day’s earnings, but those who don’t; they can’t even easily get sufficient noodles. They also eat porridge. The people with a lot of money sell high quality goods so they’re ok. But for the average seller who is not doing so well, they have to go out and gather greens, mix it up with corn noodles and eat that.
– And how often do you have rice?
That’s also a case of the well-to-do people eating well and the poor people having a hard time. With the price of rice having gone up, workers are getting at most 2000 won a month. But if the price of rice is 2500 won per kilo, then that means one month’s earnings can only buy you one kilo. The average worker’s pay is 2000 won. In Chosun, men must stamp their card at their place of work, and they’re controlled that way. Women go out to trade and somehow eke out a living.
– May I ask you what you eat?
One meal of rice, two meals of soup or porridge.
– Why do you think things have gotten that tough?
Well, there’s a food problem. It’s because of damage done to farms by floods and drought. We need fertilizer but that’s in very short supply.
– The North Korean government has said the ‘Strong and Prosperous State’ is going to be ushered in during 2012…
Nonsense. I don’t believe that.
– Why not?
Isn’t it only when a country develops that it can become a ‘Strong and Prosperous Nation’? So how can it become one by 2012, all of a sudden and from absolutely nothing? Chosun people say that things are being done in China, and things are being done in Nampo to bring back rice, but I don’t believe it. People say that money is coming in through foreign aid but people just talk. They’re just saying that.
– Are you saying most North Korean people don’t believe it?
Of course up front they say they believe it, but they really don’t. But they would never dare express their dissatisfaction. They said that the South Chosun Agency for National Security Planning agents are everywhere here in Yanji. I didn’t even know the word ‘Hanguk’ when I was in Chosun. We only hear what the Party tells us, so most people don’t know anything. If you do say something with a little depth of thought in Chosun, you’re in trouble ideologically and get exiled to the countryside.
– What do you think of Kim Jong Il?
Speaking honestly, this is what most Chosun workers think. Of course, intellectuals and genuinely smart people must think differently. Anyway, so the average common man is conditioned. All the provinces can see is Chosun Central Broadcasting. From 5 till 8 in the evening half or even more is about the General and all the onsite inspections that he has done. General stuff is all they get; that he ate rice balls when visiting soldiers, managing to catch a nap in his car since he is too busy working tirelessly for the people…
So, average people see only that. But there are people who still think differently. Me too, now that I’ve come to China, have watched South Korean TV, and seen that if the President does something bad, even he gets prosecuted. If lawmakers make errors, it’s all reported in the media. But we don’t have that freedom, you know. We simply can’t do what we want.
– Well then; in your opinion, what type of person do you think Kim Jong Il is?
When I was in Chosun I wondered why our country was like that. It’s because things are not working out. Why is it that tough? So, I didn’t like Kim Jong Il. I don’t like him, and thought, why is South Korea living well but we’re living poorly? There are nice houses in Pyongyang but why am I like this? There are a lot of nice houses in Pyongyang, you know.
– A disturbance could arise if discontent and dissatisfaction about Kim Jong Il or about high officials boil over.
Oh, you mean like a demonstration? Let me tell you this; in Chosun, the ruling officials have more complaints than the normal people. If they make a slip of the tongue it’s big trouble, too, so they can’t be reckless. National Security Agency agents are monitoring what they say, and their individual movements are being watched and recorded. Whoever doesn’t show up to work is reported and dealt with.
– Do the people connect their poverty to Kim Jong Il?
The state knows we live badly. Why is this? We hear from those who frequently come and go to foreign countries. And what do we think? A lot goes into the military and into the making of nuclear weapons and arms, so the people starve. But the government teaches us that we will have to live a colonial slave life if we don’t advance our military capability.
– Has anyone starved to death in your area?
I haven’t seen anyone myself.
– Any who committed suicide out of hardship?
There are people who have committed suicide from their struggle with everyday hardships. Even if they do commit suicide, though, it’s not reported as suicide because the family would suffer harm from that.
– How did life change after the currency redenomination?
The currency redenomination mostly ruined the people who had some money rather than the poor ones. So, average people were totally shocked by it. Had they done it when life was ok, then the damage wouldn’t have been this bad. But because they did it in a situation where there was nothing, ordinary life got even worse.
– Please tell me about the situation at the time.
The way the government carried out the currency redenomination was that for every 100,000 won that was submitted per household, 1000 won would be given in exchange. For every 100,000 won, there was also a 500 won compensatory payment per head, so that means a family of 3 would get 1500 won extra. The people who had some money came out with not much remaining at all. The people who had more money were fine because they were holding it in dollars. So the middle sellers were the ones who caught the full force of the redenomination. These people moved a lot of stock and used a lot of currency; without that, money doesn’t move in the markets.
– How about yourself?
At first, it was good. They were saying handover 100,000 won; we didn’t even have 10,000 won, and barely just a bit of rice. And so, as we didn’t have money when the currency was being exchanged, we had nothing to worry about. But people with larger amounts of money who couldn’t exchange all they had did come to us and ask us to exchange it for them. They said they would give 200 won for the transaction. At first there were those who were doing it at a 20% commission, and then others came out saying they would do it for a 50% or even 70% commission.
– What do you mean, “At first, it was good”?
You give 100,000 won and 1000 won comes back. As a family of 3, we were given 1500 won in compensation, which meant that we had 2500 won. At the time, the state lowered prices in the new currency, so the price of rice went down to 15 won. If we had bought and stored a lot of rice at that time, the price would have risen and we would have benefited. Believing that the price would go down even more we waited, thinking that this could really be the dawn of a new life. However, the price shot up again and later recovered to 2000 won. And at that, the money we had just disappeared right before our very eyes.
– And how about now?
The people who have things live well, you know. It’s like before. But poor people don’t have things. So the well-off people live well. But lately, even the middle men don’t have money, so trade has died.
– What do you mostly hear from the authorities?
That they’re implementing CNC technology, and that our standard of living is getting better owing to so much of this automated technology. But now that I have come out here, I hear that CNC has been around in China for 50 years. When I was in Chosun I thought that would happen, but nothing really changed at all. And even if you have a complaint, you can’t say so. People know nothing besides earning money to live and feed yourself somehow while parroting “it’s all good”. But where are the people who really mean it? Still, people do curse the state and cadres. Everyone does that now.
